Call to Arms

by Gareth H Thomas

2 August 2007

 

C2A Meeting 1900 1st August 2007

Location: Disable Room, CAP

Attendees: C2A committee and others (total 30 people)

Topic: How can supporters have a greater input to/understanding of the running of CRFC Ltd.?

The following are minutes of what was said at the meeting. They are not a definitive explanation of facts. There are a number of issues that still need to be verified by C2A.

Roy Pearce (Secretary C2A) and Ian Tabor (Chairman C2A) made opening introductory speaches. Ian said meeting was called to canvas opinion. Roy said now was the time for action ? before the situation will ?go away from us?. Presentation then handed to Philip Thomas presented details of the sitatuation.

The points he made were as follows ...

Stadium

• CAC is the landlord for CRFC and the major shareholder
• There are 15 years remaining on the present lease for the rugby team
• The team ?Cardiff Blues? do not have a right to play on CAP as they are not the original signatories to the lease agreement.
• There is huge potential to develop the exisiting site, but CAC needs the funds, vision and energy to make it happen. The council could oppose any changes, but this issue will be addressed when and if it arises.  There are hurdles to overcome, but there are many  property developers on the board of CRFC Ltd, so the expertise is available.
• Paul Baily (Director of CRFC Ltd) produced a feasibility report to turn the pitch through 90 degrees and further develop the site some years ago. This would produce a banqueting arena where sponsors could walk directly to the pitch. The land exists and the potential exists.
• Should CAP be sold, under the present CAC structure, the rugby section will receive a proportion of any proceeds far less than they should do considering their overwhelming majority of numbers. Scotsman Rodney Burman (Lib Dem leader of Cardiff Cardiff City Council and soccer supporter) wants the premiership side to play on the outfield Sophia Gardens.
• There is an argument over ground maintenance ? CAC claim that it is the responsibility of CRFC Ltd, but the rugby club feel that CAC are the landlords. As a result, little improvements have been made to the ground and many of these have been done by Call to Arms.
• The present board of CRFC Ltd claim that they are already milking 90% of the commercial potential of the ground. Very few ? if any ? attendees at the meeting believed this.
• The board will present the move as a done deal to supporters.
• There is a fear that other sport sections of CAC want to get hold of the proceeds of the sale of this land ? sections who have a vastly disproportate number of members, and sections who have little or no interest in the use of CAP other than for their own short term financial gain.

Shares

• When regionalism was sold to the supporters in 2003 it was presented as things would largely remain the same.
• At the moment, no one talks to supporters and keeps them informed of what is going on. Indeed the business plan for the move to the new stadium actually includes a plan for a reduction in attendance and loss of supporters. It is planned that corporate income will offset this ? so the move is largely for corporate reasons, and has nothing to do with what is best for supporters.
• The heritage shares are controlled by CAC who have three members on the board of CRFC Ltd
• ?35 entitles membership of CAC
• unrest exists between CAC and the other members of the board of CRFC Ltd. Much of the communications take place between solicitors with little direct contact.
• When C2A was first formed, meetings took place between Philip Thomas (previous Chairman of C2A) and Alun Doull (Finance Director) and Robert Norster (Chief Executive). The two board members' hope was the C2A should take over CAC's roll on the board of CRFC Ltd.
• If C2A can control CAC's 1.2 million shares, then this gives an avenue for supporters to have an input into the running of CRFC Ltd.
• Step One is to get these three seats on the board of CRFC Ltd. As present the three CAC members on the board seem only interested in the premiership team and seem to be working towards a permanent separation of the two sides.

The Premiership Side

• Theory is that if CRFC Ltd take the Blues away they must continue to allow the Premiership side to play at CAP.
• The running of the premiership side has largely been handed over to CAC by the board of CRFC Ltd
• There have already been efforts made by CAC to remove the premiership side from Cardiff RFC Ltd. These moves were rejected by the WRU
• Peter Thomas was willing to sell the premiership side to CAC and then correspondingly to take the Blues away from CAP.

Question and Answers session

• How quickly can a CAC SGM be called?
• 30 CAC members need to call an SGM and the meeting will probably take between one and two weeks to be called.
• How is the membership of CAC broken down?
• There are around 2,000 members ? 1,800 from the rugby section with the rest made up of cricket, bowls and hockey.
• It is time for a demarcation between the rugby and other sporting sections.
• Are we members of CAC even if we are not playing members?
• Legal advice tells us that we are members of CAC even if we are not playing members.
• What happens if people are on holiday?
• The 30 members who call the SGM, do not necessarily have to be at the meeting.
• Should we delay the meeting until September or act more quickly?
• This was a major discussion point ? please see actions below to see proposed timescale.
• The more notice we give CAC, the more danger there is that we can motivate those with opposing views.
• We need to raise the profile of C2A. How should we do this? How can we raise money for the battle ahead? T- Shirts, Badges .... etc.
• See action points below
• How many days notice does CAC need to give of the SGM?
• At least 7 days in writing
• Do the heritage shares have any specific role?
• Yes. The heritage shares confer auditing rites ? see Appendix 3 of the hand out.
• Do we need to get the press involved?
• It was agreed that the press are already controlled, and until a clear strategy is decided, we should not yet involve the press.
• Is it a good idea to make an enemy of Peter Thomas?
• When a previous move away from CAP was floated (to the Bay), 600-700 people met in Sophia Gardens to stop the move. Peter Thomas got a bloody nose. Members fought last time and won. We can win again.
• Peter Thomas is not the enemy, CAC is the enemy.
• We should encourage dialog with the present board. We should not be alienating people
• Can the present limitations on the use of the ground be overturned?
• Yes. With the agreement of all parties.
• Should we get Cardiff City Supporters on board with our ideas?
• Not at this stage as this would create a confused message.
• Sale of CAP is inevitable. The Council want to host a European Soccer final in the Millennium Stadium and the only way to do this is to have conference facilities on site. The council will force through a compulsory purchase.
• There are numerous plans in progress ? one to site conference facilities behind Yate's (wine bar on Westgate Street).
• If a compulsory purchase does take place, then it is still better for the fans to be better represented by CAC in order to get maximum benefit for the rugby section.
• Why is the Premiership side's web site so poor?
• The limited company won't spend money on this site as the board think that if they do so they should also make investments in the web sites of all the other clubs in the region. But the club runs two sides ? how can the club invest money in other clubs competing with CRFC Ltd? This confused logic is holding back the development of the team, the ground, and the club/region.
• Is the board maximizing the business potential of CAP? They say they have sold all boxes for the forthcoming season.
• Overwhelming feeling of the meeting was that CAP is not being fully utilized. The fact that the only investments in facilities are being made by C2A is pretty much a giveaway on that point. There was also a claim that a company called the club for a box for the Bristol game and was told there was one available, So claims by the club were treated with some skepticism.
• Average age of attendees at the meeting was probably top 30s. What about older members? How do we get older members (who are not necessarily on the internet) involved?
• See actions below

Each person attending was asked to give their contact details so that they can be kept informed of what follows the meeting and relied on to canvas support for the fight ahead. Each attendee was asked by Ian and Roy to talk to their family and friends about what is happening and begin to motivate supporters.

An action committee was formed by the C2A chairman to co-ordinate this project and make proposals for the text of the SGM resolution.

Members are as follows .....

Martyn Winters

Neil MacSorley

Clive Williams

Philip Thomas

Gareth H Thomas

Actions:

(Where it wasn't clear who would take the action, I have allocated it to the Chairman of the Trust with the understanding that he will delegate it to an appropriate person).

• Roy to forward list of shareholders to members of new action committee (asap). Action: Roy to create a distribution list to forward minutes of the meeting. Roy to send details of e-mail addresses to the action committee,
• Action committee to draw up resultion for CAC SGM by 6th August
• Ian to contact CAC rugby board members when draft of SGM resolution is agreed upon.
• Need legal advice on what CAC can and cannot do. There was a case recently where CAC called a meeting without the participation of the rugby section. Was this meeting legal? Action: Action committee to look for legal advice? Immediately!
• C2A committee need to explore how to raise money through merchandising. Ian made the point that C2A must be more active in promoting C2A membership once the season starts. Fans are slow to act and move but quick to moan. Action: Ian
• Contact needs to be made with John Smart. At least one or two other board members are likely to side with C2A. However, Smart has sent his solicitor to board meetings. C2A needs to canvas Smart for his opinions. Action: Ian.
• At the Pertemp Bees and Gloucester game, C2A members will walk through the downstairs bar and distribute the leaflets presented at this meeting explaing what is happening at the club. We need to canvas views, motivate and ensure a maximum turnout for the CAC SGM and any subsequent votes that take place. Action: Ian.
• Should we write to Delme Parfitt? When should we write to Delme Parfitt? Action: Ian
• CAC membership time frames ? what are the starting and ending dates? Ian to investigate
• Ian to contact existing two members of CAC who sit on the board of Cardiff RFC limited as well as the solicitor Christopher Nott.
• How do we get older members involved (those who are not necessarily on the internet)? Action: Ian.

All actions to be completed by the next meeting which will take place on 11th August before the Pertemp Bees game (Six members of Action Committee and Chairman and Secretary of C2A will attend).